Fidelity ETF Exchange - Q1 2024 Canadian ETF Industry Recap

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In this episode of the fidelity ETF exchange, host Étienne Joncas Bouchard welcomes Vince Kraljevic to the show. Vince is an ETF strategist at Fidelity Canada, and in this episode, Etienne and Vince break down all of the notable trends in Q1 of 2024. Flows in the Canadian ETF industry continue their strong momentum in Q1, bringing in a total of $13.8 billion in assets. Some of the notable headlines include a roaring return for equities with inflows of $10.2 billion dollars, but only 145 million going towards Canadian equity mandates. On the fixed income side, high interest saving fund ETFs have started to show signs of slowing down as investors increase their risk appetite. Lastly, the cryptocurrency category broadly saw outflows in Canada in conjunction with the approval by the SEC for U.S. listed spot Bitcoin ETFs.

This podcast was recorded on April 23rd, 2024.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Hello, everyone, and welcome to the fidelity ETF exchange. I'm your host Etienne aka EJB. Very happy to be back with another episode for you today. As we always do, we're going to be doing a recap of the quarterly ETF industry trends for the Canadian market. Joining me today is, a special guest from from our team, Vince Kraljevic of which is an ETF strategist here at Fidelity.

He joined us close to two years ago now. And it's already been a really great contributor is our team has had the opportunity to meet with advisors across the country and get some really good insights on, on those trends that we're going to be discussing today. So, Vince, thanks. Thanks for joining us.

Vince Kraljevic: EJB, thanks for having me. I was wondering if this was ever going to happen.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Well, we've been planning it for a while and I think, now is a great time. I mean, you actually just got back from our due diligence event also. So I'm going to be maybe pick your brain on that, on some of the comments from our RPM, some of the comments from, of our industry experts that we're presenting there. But, you know, we we are going to be focusing on the Canadian ETF industry, and we'll get right into that in a second. But as usual, just a quick recap of our last episode that you can catch on fidelity TCA or your favorite podcast app. I had the chance to host our colleague, actually Brendan Sims, who is an alternative strategist here at fidelity. We had a really, good chat, deep dive into the alts industry. What are the different types of strategies? How are they incorporated in portfolios? The differences between holding an all or liquid all strategy in an ETF and a fund. So really good insights there. And feel free to, to have a listen.

All right. So for today on deck is first quarter. It's been a really hot start to the year from from an ETF industry standpoint. Last year we had mentioned it was a really great year at around 38 billion in net new assets. So far this year at the end of March, we're talking, you know, close to 14 billion in net new assets coming into the Canadian ETF industry. That is mainly led by equities with around 10 billion, in inflows. We can see about 2.8 billion on the fixed income side. So that's, you know, pretty much close to the totality, another category that's getting, you know, good traction is the multi-asset category.

So ETF portfolios kind of those turnkey, you know, solutions that combine equity mandates, fixed income mandates to get that core diversified exposure. And, you know, the one outflow category that we see so far this year is in the crypto space. But there are, you know, a few asterisks there, I think with the new regulations that have, I mean, come online, if you will, in the US. So maybe a bit of repatriation of assets from US investors. But all in all, you know, those are the the main key points. But we're going to take a deep dive into that just right now. Vince, what stood out to you? What are some of the things that, you know, caught your eye in this first quarter?

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah, no. So, just to build on what you said, Q1 was a fantastic year for ETFs. I think, I was reading stat that we had nine straight, record highs just in terms of asset sizes. That's a bit that includes flows as well as just, growth and market. It was a risk on type of market. But what I what stood out to me of Q1 was actually what I'm going to call a return to normal. Right? So I've been in the industry for a bit too long. But 2023 was this very choppy year like prior to 2023. It my my job was pretty easy because I'd walk into an office and know what I'm going to talk about. So let's go back a few years. Everyone wants to know about thematics, right? So for like 6 to 9 months it's internet of things, artificial intelligence, autonomous vehicles, things along those lines. And then it was ESG 6 to 9 months.

It was just talking about ESG than Bitcoin. Then his is like but you knew that you were walking into an office and like 90% of the time, that's what you were going to be talking about. Last year, 2020 3rd January was really brisk on. So it was, a junk rally. So it was all about equities, international equities, to be specific. Then February was long, long duration and then March was his as April was whatever it was. And inflow was an outflow the very next. So very, very choppy. But at the end of last year, the Federal Reserve kind of indicated that they might kind of start cutting interest rates or they were going to consider. And then it came like a risk on kind of trade at the end of last year. And that kind of flowed into, Q1 of this year. And the funny thing is of last year, there was all this talk about The Magnificent Seven. But if you look at the flows of last year, US equities in the ETF space were actually redemptions until December. It was only until like a 1.1. $5 billion trade that came in at December, to kind of bring it to like I think it was, 600 million net inflows in that category, last year and from November, December. And that was that was the trade that kind of carried on into Q1.

It was risk on, you kind of gave the high level numbers was like 10 billion, to equities specifically was about 6 billion to U.S. equities. So it was like, you know, the Fed's going to pivot risk on. Type trade for building to international. And so that was kind of another trade, unfortunately for Canada. You know, we've heard all the stories the consumers over levered. We have five year mortgages. The United States has fixed. So like it's flat for Canada generally speaking. So but at least for Q1, it was like you knew these were going to be the talking points or you were going to be talking about. And then the other thing was, in January, there's the regulatory change. We can talk about that a bit about his, so, in terms of flows towards that type of asset, like flat for Q1, really didn't even chat about it. But like the biggest conversation piece up until almost the last week, I would say, was risk on equities. And then when the resilience of the United States conversation started changing a bit. But I guess we'll talk about that in our Q2.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Yeah. So like you said, last week was kind of a bit of a take the the foot off the gas a little bit, a bit of volatility coming back to markets and maybe starting to see a bit more of okay. Well, you know, maybe we can't just keep going on and on and hitting new all time highs. You know, on, on on a weekly if not monthly basis. One point that you mentioned that I thought was really interesting with regards to the breakdown of regions for equities, right. Because we mentioned 10 billion in equities, but that's isn't that is not even with regards to like the the AUM split that currently exists in the Canadian ETF industry. Right. Like right. You know, as of now, about 20% of all its, ETFs listed in Canada are in Canadian equity mandates, 23% in the US and and 19% in international.

So it's like more or less about a third in each, you know, main region international, obviously, including emerging markets and others. But it was a it's an a third in each region. And so far this year Canada like you said, is, you know, barely positive 145 million net new assets versus 6 billion for the US, 4 billion for international. Is that, you know, you you did allude to it with regards to maybe the the economic prospectus for Canada being a bit more dire relative to say, the US. I don't know. You know, I don't I don't know if that argument holds necessarily for international. Is there another reason why you think there's a bit more demand for international? Because 4 billion isn't nothing. And I think in last year it was actually the leading equity category from a flow standpoint is that, you know, any any insights that that you have on, on that maybe in conversations you've had or, you know, what's piqued the interest of Canadian investors with, you know, ECS, North America.

Vince Kraljevic: The big so in my conversations, again, it's even with the United States, it's the Magnificent Seven. The concentration of those seven companies. It's it's just so massive. Right. Like it's let's call it 30% or a third of the S&P 500. And now the United States makes up 7% of the MSCI world. So a lot of people are trying to diversify away from this hydration equity duration kind of magnificent seven. And the best way of doing that. And Canada is concentrated at financials materials energy. Right. So we're concentrating in three sectors. Let's call it a handful of banks. So a lot of investors are just trying to find a way of diversifying and mitigating the risk. And from a valuation perspective, from a number of things that we can get into, international just looks a bit better to kind of, you know, relative to Canada.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: I think the diversification point makes a lot of sense, right? Like you're trying to find something that's going to help offset some. Not to say that like those, you know, let's say Magnificent Seven or even just the top ten of the S&P 500 because, I mean, realistically, the two ETFs have had the most flows in the Canadian market so far this year are two S&P 500 ETFs. Right. So there's still a lot of interest there. But at the same time there is that thought or maybe that, you know, maybe a further down the road that if there is volatility there for, for, for whatever reason, you know, have a portion of a portfolio, it's not going to be as correlated to say, the growth segment and then just us in general. So I think that's definitely a case to be made. And valuations like, like you said, are definitely cheaper overseas.

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah. Yeah. And and just to build on a conversation we were having a bit before it, if you look at the sector concentration, the holdings concentration of international is just it's just more diversified and you can find more names just not so concentrated in a handful of sectors and not names.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Yeah. Like the majority. Anyways, on the ETF side let's say I mean the fun side. You obviously going to find more active managers at some of them even have the flexibility to be more global to a certain extent inclusive some us. But when you're thinking of international equities for an ETF standpoint, you know, about 80% of that, if not a bit more is actually in in MSCI if you benchmark ETFs. Right. So that that international space is really just international developed for the most part there is emerging markets assets. But for the most part it's you know a lot of Europe, some Japan and a few other you know Asia, Asia Pacific net countries. But like you said, from from a sector stand. Point the spread between the largest and smallest sectors much smaller.

You also have, you know, about 15% in the top ten versus 28, 29 and 30 even in the US and in 35% in Canada. Like that's a much different type of index. So yeah, no interesting comments there. The next place I want to go and we have to address it because like you said, there were regulatory changes in January with regards to high interest savings ETFs or as you mentioned, his ETFs. You know that's that basically impacted the I guess target yield for some of those products. You know, changing the regulations with regards to the way that those deposits are treated, being wholesale and not retail. Bringing yields down a bit closer to the overnight lending rates. And, you've seen flows slow down. It's 400 million of the 2.8 in, in bonds. So that's good for close to 15%. Last year it was more like 50%. So that dynamics changed quite a bit. Is it to you? Is it the main reason that yields have come down a bit? Or is it just because there's now a bit more of an appetite to go back to fixed income markets. Post obviously in November and December, which was outstanding from a performance standpoint, but also maybe the consideration that maybe it will take it won't be as quick to cut rates, but the next move is likely going to be a cut in and in an area where you would like to have duration.

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah, yeah. No.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Or they both work together basically. But I mean, yeah.

Vince Kraljevic: It's hard to it's hard to unwind how much of what like there was the regulatory changes. But those regulatory I don't want.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: An exact percentage like 60.

Vince Kraljevic: 7030. So they'll.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: You go.

Vince Kraljevic: You know, and like when you think about it, like when you went from wholesale to retail, like when they made that regulation, regulatory change was like maybe 50 basis points or half a percent of the total yield of the product. But I think that change happened right when it was a risk on. So people were thinking they're cutting rates. So a lot of the flows start diving deeper into the fixed income. A lot of those $2.8 billion worth of flows went into long duration because they thought that interest rates were going to be cut so that the long end of the yield curve was going to come down, and you weren't going to get that duration pickup. So you would have not only the yield, but you had that capital appreciation. You know, we were talking about potentially double digit, total returns for the year. Early in the year at around this time. So I think it's a bit twofold. There was the regulatory changes, and then there was the opportunity for double digit gains in fixed income, which a lot of people are trying to position for. And yeah, the regulatory changes for his, as I think they're equivalent to money market now effectively like we can get into the fire money issue. I'm like the 0 to 90 day yield curve. And which one to pay higher in which regard. But yeah I think the product's not dead, but they're going to be a bit more specific use cases for it going forward. Yeah.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: No, for sure I think and you're starting to see that reflected. Like you said, if you look like a bit, you know, more granular, if you will, into the fixed income category. You can actually see, like you said, like broad or mixed category, which is basically I get bond indices. So it incorporates kind of everything that's out there, if you will, on the Canadian market, on the US market, that's the category that is leading the way. And you're actually seeing outflows on short term and mid-term, focused products so that, you know, either 1 to 3 years or 2 to 5 years, even, you know, maybe a bit longer than that. But, you know, anything that's longer than the benchmark is actually getting inflows. So basically longer than seven and a half years on the on the Footsie Canada Universe bond index.

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah. So based off of that I would say that people are adding duration. Right. They're getting off the lower. And so it's just not it's not high interest savings ETFs. We're we're hit was all kind of shorter duration. People are kind of going out on the on the yield curve.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Exactly.

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: And what's interesting and this is I don't know if there's something that's come up in, you know, some conversations you've had. It's something that I've heard quite a bit is, you know, last year, there was a lot of fear just from the investor standpoint because of how hard 2022 was. Right. So you saw a lot of appetite for cash alternatives. I mean, we're we're not talking about we're talking about his says. But I mean, guy, he's had an explosion in terms of inflows last year. And you know, for for a lot of those, you look at the total return to come at year end. And it was one of the, the if it was probably the worst performing, asset class. And a lot of those investors, actually didn't come from like typical bonds. A lot of them came from, you know, balanced portfolios or came from, you know, equity portfolios where it's, you know, full shift in the risk spectrum, not so much. Just, let me park this these bonds and cash. It's basically just taking cash or taking, risk assets on the to the sidelines. And I think what we've seen is actually probably some this is just skipping, you know, the natural flow through which would be back to bonds and just straight back into the S&P 500, which is maybe an argument why we've seen such high flows in equities is, you know, cash is going back straight to equities. And taking, you know, statements were nice come, come end of last year. And I think that, you know, really reignited a risk appetite from the investor community.

Vince Kraljevic: No, no, I completely agree with you. There was the whole conversation about money on the sidelines and it's really the pendulum. Right. So everyone's really, really risk off. And then they see these excellent returns in stock market. And then next thing you know everyone wants to dive headfirst right back in. And I think that's where you need advisors to kind of like make sure that you're kind of following your long term investment strategy. Make sure you KYC is up to date and things along those lines.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. Where should we go next? I mean, I think one thing we have to is just I don't want to spend too much time on it, but it is interesting to see that there there's albeit, you know, Bitcoin's been performing relatively well up until, say, the last week or so. Once again, you know, the.

Vince Kraljevic: Kind of that we're Q1, we're talking about Q1. So it was great. Yeah.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Right. So technically end of March, it was still very fantastic. Exactly. Because as of recording, obviously we're recording, you know, mid-April, we're a bit late on this. But, you know, we wanted to make sure to, to get it, to get it in for everyone. But, Bitcoin ETFs are seeing outflows this year in Canada. You know, we suspect some of that is repatriation of assets to us. But, it could also just be, you know, a bit of, you know, taking some gains. And, you know, we've seen the new, federal budget, maybe some people are thinking, take some capital gains now before the inclusion rate goes up. Any thoughts on on that space, which has been one that was, you know, kind of unique to Canada up until recently, where now there's Bitcoin ETFs around the world.

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah. No, I think you hit the nail on the head. I think a lot of it's repatriation of assets right. So Canada is relatively small. You have to convert U.S. dollars Canadian. So there's the currency conversion. People are concerned about you combining US dollar versions in some cases. But when you think about, the United States, the United States is I call it the ten factor. Right? So if the population of Canada is, let's call it 40 million. Yeah, it's it's just 400. If the ETF in Canada's a billion, it'll be 10 billion in the United States. So it's just in the United States. There's the possibility of these Bitcoin ETF to just be larger, which means that the MDR, the costs drop, there's more liquidity things along those lines. So yes, you could invest in Canadian ETFs, before the United States. But I think a lot of people are betting on the U.S versions to be bigger, cheaper and more liquid. Yeah.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Yeah. I mean, there is the benefit, like you said, of size, right? I think it just makes it there's more secondary liquidity than there would be in the Canadian market. And you know, if you're a U.S institution or U.S asset manager or whatever it may be, that is maybe also just a, compliance thing that makes it easier, right? Or legal. Yeah.

Vince Kraljevic: And like, we're not tax professional, but there's a different tax treatment of Canadians buying US training ETFs and U.S. ETFs. So I'm pretty sure the United States probably has similar rules, things along those lines. So there could be a number of other issues that we're not going to get into. We're just focusing on the ETF structure aspect of it. And again, to just to clarify one thing, we also have Bitcoin ETF and it wasn't in redemptions.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: So yeah. Well I think fidelity was, was quite reactive to, to the new issuances in the US. And we actually, you know, reduced our management fee, cut it by a bit more than half. So I think that's in response to now having a lot more competition in the market and, and see and facing that reality. But, yeah. So I don't want to spend too much time on Bitcoin. I think, you know, we did address it. I think that's you know, it is noteworthy. I think a lot of the audience that listen to this podcast probably are, are interested in that stuff. But one area that I think is relevant to, to, to all investors and, and advisors is the multi-asset category, which is like I mentioned in my intro, is is a category that includes ETF portfolios, which are, you know, ETFs of ETFs, if you will, right the they're packaged or managed solutions that, incorporate, you know, between 16 and sometimes 15, 20 ETFs that are all all packaged into one ticker, you know, simplifies things to a certain extent.

Make sure that the rebalance, you get exposure to equities to bonds. You can choose your risk profile. You can range from, you know, 80% bonds to, you know, 100% equity, if you will. Those portfolios, I think, are attractive to more and more, investors and advisors, like I said, as a core allocation to a portfolio and then building around it or using it as an, you know, entirety of a portfolio that's been a positive category for the past 4 or 5 years. I think, it's fairly consistent. It's fairly sticky. Also, you don't you rarely see outflows from that category. What are your thoughts on that space? How have you seen it evolve? Obviously asset fidelity. You know, we're right in the thick of things, if you will, with. Are all in one ETFs. Being a large driver of flows in our. For our firm. Any comments with regards to that category events and kind of the adoption, if you will, of those types of solutions.

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah. The the adoption rate is kind of phenomenal in terms of seeing it. And you know what I'm kind of calling them just balanced ETFs. Now there's balanced mutual funds. It's growing balanced ETFs. And it kind of like once you say that people kind of get it right away. but yeah it's points that you've highlighted in the remember how I said like it's a return to normal for this asset class category? It's been normal for the last five, six years. Like it's consistently been getting assets. It's never had a, a redemption, monthly redemption. And the last 5 or 6 years, growing at an accelerated rate. It this RSP season for the, for the category, for the multi-asset category or the balanced ETF category, let's call it best RSP season in the last 5 or 6 years. And it's just picking up pace.

And if you look at our all in ones because obviously we're familiar with ours, we went from I think the beginning of last year it was 300 million, and we ended the year at a billion in terms of A1 in the product. So it's more than tripled in size. And we saw that continuing to Q1. It's like one of the biggest conversations. It hit its three year track number, at the end of last year. So it gets flagged a lot more and a lot more people are proactively asking me questions about it now. And to your point, it's a simple turnkey solution comes an excellent core in exploring an a product at a low cost. So there's definitely a lot of, interest in it. And, I think I may have said this earlier, if you look at the capture rate, it's kind of double digit like of all the ETFs, it's consistently capturing about 10 to 15% of all flows on a look back of the last 12 months. So, it's definitely an asset class or a product to keep an eye on.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Yeah. No, actually, I think you hit the nail on the head there. It is a category that you like. You said, it's been very, very consistent. And like, we don't spend too much time on it because it's just that it's consistent. There's never really big, huge, massive outflows that it's never in like these massive whopping inflows either. Like equities like in flip flop one, one quarter to another or one year to another. But I definitely keep an eye out for, for that as we move forward.

Vince Kraljevic: And just build on the flows. So like equities can have like 1,520% up and then fixed income 20% down. But like when you have a single taken solution you have one line item. It kind of normalizes the return in clients portfolios as well, which I think, people are interested in not having wild swings in one's portfolio.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Yeah, that's a great point. There's another category that another category I want to touch on. And actually, this is something I might, I, this might be coming out of left field a little bit. So I mean bear with me if, if, if it's not front and center. But I was looking through the flows, earlier and, and one thing that stuck out that, I don't know, it's, it's odd to me a little bit is sector ETFs are actually in pretty decent outflows, like close to $1 billion in outflows in sector specific ETFs. So far this year that's about 12% of of its total assets. Right. So it's it's quite sizable. Is there an argument for maybe trying to like, maybe trying to be less picky on certain sectors and just focusing on something more broad? Or is it a lot of those assets or maybe in sectors that are out of favor, you know, and any comments there? And, you know, if there are none, that's all good. By all means on my end. But.

Vince Kraljevic: No, no, no, no, it's a great point. And I think a lot of those flows, outflows came from financials because a lot of people were, afraid of financials, specifically Canadian financials. So there's a lot of outflows there. But like when I, when I talk with advisor and I ask them why they buying financial ETFs or utility ETFs or tech ETFs, they always kind of say, well, I'm buying financials because I want a dividend. And I'm like, well why don't you buy a dividend factor ETF or I want utilities because I don't like there's slow and steady. So I'm like well you want low vol right. So they're kind of by buying. My argument is when you buy a sector ETFs and you're trying to target growth or technically a factor, why are you exposing yourself to the regulatory risk. Right. Like if you're going to buy tech there's a chances of they're going to be sued because of a number of, invasion of privacy.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Yeah.

Vince Kraljevic: Like, you know, are they going to be broken up or they're not going to be broken up? Are they going to get sued this week or they're not? So you're kind of exposing yourself to regulatory risk. So I'm like, why don't you if you're trying to look for dividend, if you're trying to look for a lowball, if you go with the factor based ETF, you're you're kind of diversifying your sector risk and you're accomplishing what the client's goal is. I've never heard of a client ever walk in and saying like, oh, I want tech because of dividend or you know what I mean? It's always like. They're trying to accomplish, like, oh, this is my life savings. I don't want to lose it or I'm relatively young. Let's invest with momentum. Things along those lines.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Yeah, yeah. So outcome oriented type ideas. Right. That in reality could probably be or more like more than likely could be accomplished with something that's a bit less sector focused. But, anyway, I just thought I was intrigued. But you did mention that financials the lead leading like so I like I said, it's close to a billion in outflows. Well, there is literally a billion in outflows in finance from financials ETFs. And a lot of that is bank ETFs. Canadian bank ETFs that are you know, you know, with, with kind of this once again, like that economic environment we have here in Canada, highly levered consumer rates are coming higher. A lot of people are going to have to renew their mortgages in the next two years. You know, that's maybe one of the, you know, key risks that's being guys brought into the thought process, if you will, from from that investment selection.

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah. And financials, the way that I described financials, it's a lever play on the economy. Right. So it is a cyclical right. So if you think that Canada is going to slow down then financials your credit growth and things along those lines. So financials would be hit a bit stronger. So it kind of makes sense that people are thinking slow down in Canada.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: All right Vince I mean we're already at 25 minutes. I want to ask you one last question, as we kind of always do this for on the quarterly recaps is, you know, a trend that you think, will either continue or something that will manifest itself over the next, let's call it, you know, three quarters. We're only one quarter down so far this year. Something that you think will continue.

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah, I think, a bit of last year. What happened last year is kind of start transpiring, like the the resilience of the US economy. Are they going to cut. Are they not going to cut. Is there a hike. Because now people are referring to there's a potentially hike. So I think there's going to be a lot of volatility going forward. And my argument to times and volatility or if you're not really certain what's going to happen, diversification is your friend. Right. And I guess that's why a lot of people are looking at the all in ones. It's you're not making call on equities or fixed income into one ticket solution. So I think volatility is the trend. We're going to see a lot of conversation about low duration, long duration US equities, international equities. I think it's going to be a busy year for us.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Awesome awesome. Well I I'd say that at the start of the year when I did this with Andre after the end of Q4, I put it out there that I think there would be a renewed a little bit of appetite for ESG ETFs. And and we have seen that, but very little. It's 500 million net new assets. But I'll change my I'll change my, my you know, opinion on opinion. But my thoughts on that perspective and I think there will be renewed appetite for duration as we go throughout the year and we get more clarity on where, central bank policy is headed. So that's going to be my thing that I'm keeping an eye out for the next nine months.

Vince Kraljevic: Oh, in nine months, active ETFs, I think, we didn't try to about it.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Oh, yeah. That's true.

Vince Kraljevic: Yeah. Next, we always follow the United States. The United States, has approved nontransparent ETFs. Once that bites, I think, active ETFs are going to be, a massive growth in the later half of 2024. But, we'll leave that for, the Q2 story, I think.

Étienne Joncas Bouchard: Exactly. So now I'm going to have to get you back on for for the end of Q2 so we can talk about active ETFs, which, like you said, has been a real growth story in the US. And we're starting to see that in Canada. Obviously, us at fidelity, we are participating there with a number of our managers now available in an ETF tickers. So really cool little space there. But Vince, thank you so much for doing this. It's always a pleasure. And and I just want to thank everyone, listening into this. We really appreciate your support. Until next time. Thank you.

Vince Kraljevic: Thank you for having me. And everybody. Thanks for listening.

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The views and opinions expressed on this podcast are those of the participants, and do not necessarily reflect those of Fidelity Investments Canada ULC or its affiliates. This podcast is for informational purposes only, and should not be construed as investment, tax, or legal advice.

It is not an offer to sell or buy, or an endorsement, recommendation, or sponsorship of any entity or security cited. Read a fund’s prospectus before investing. Funds are not guaranteed. Their values change frequently, and past performance may not be repeated. Fees, expenses and commissions are all associated with fund investments.

frequently and past performance may not be repeated. Fees, expenses and commissions are all associated with fund investments.